Lounge Start Up Planning - People Count Question

[djdbarton]

A little bit of background... My wife and I are planning to open a lounge here in San Francisco. We want to serve "american" tapas as well as cocktails. We aim to have dj's and possibly live acts. Having never owned a lounge, bar or restaurant, we are learning quite a bit as we go. We are hoping to find that lists such as this one will be able to provide us with a wealth of information.

QUESTION:
How many people would fit into a 2000 - 2500 sq ft space? We wanted to know if anyone could figure this out just on square footage alone. Or if there is a fire code resource that states what the legal occupancy is per square footage. (Obviously, with furniture, bar, equipment, bathrooms, etc, the number will shrink, but a ball park idea would be great).

Thanks so much.

[barworker]

As I recall, The Fire Marshal will determine your occupancy level after inspecting the place, unless one is already posted. This will be determined with the equasion: sitting room(tables & chairs) vs. standing room. The avererage used to be that every person consumes 2 square feet. It's been a while since I had to deal with an occupancy issue, so I may be totally wrong here. Here's a little known fact though. If the building already has an occupancy level posted, dont trust it. It may have been determined when it was origanally built. If it has been renovated in any way over the years, it would have a big factor on that number. Our nightclub was a former pizza place, and had gone through many renovations in the last 15 years, yet the occupancy level posted stayed the same. We knew that we could fit more than 534 people in there(comfortably). So we spent the money and hired an architect to take pictures and do EXACT measurements. As it turns out, due to the changes in the floor plan over the years, we had more room. We showed the Fire Marshal the architects statements and had the level raised to 747. Imagine how much money could have been made with cover charges if we knew that years ago. I suggest anyone who owns a nightclub or bar to fork out the money to have it re-calculated if they bought the place and renovated it. You may be surpised at the extra room the'll give you. I apologize for rambling on & any spelling mistakes...It's 4am in Illinois and I just got off work. Damn you Jack Daniels & your buddy Quervo too.

Jeff
-fellow barworker

[djdbarton]

Jeff, no worries on rambling. It was actually quite comprehensive - thank you so much!

[dmontrond]

Hi this is my first time on this site and I must say I'm very impressed. I have been trying to find a good place to go and get information on the business and or ownership of a night club and I think I found it. Anyhow the reason I'm writting to you is because you seem to be in the starting stage and I was wondering if you could give any advise or pointers to help me through the process of researching and working towards establishing a night club or lounge in the Boston area or right outside of the major city. Any info would very helpfull and greatly appreciated. Thanks and sorry for any inconvinience.

[djdbarton]

Dmontrond,

I am certainly in the planning stages of starting up a new business, but I have been researching numerous aspects for many months now. I think to make this list useful, you need to have specific questions because there are SO many aspects to starting your own business (not to mention a nightclub with dancing and alchohol).

If you have specific questions, I would be more than happy to share what I have learned or give you ideas on where/what to ask.

Where are you at in your process? Have you just started thinking about it? Have you called the local SBA office for a starter kit? Have you researched neccessary licenses, permits, etc?

If you are just beginning the research, I would start by getting the SBA starter kit (free), buying a book called "UPS Guide to Owning & Managing a Bar or Tavern" by Roy S. Alonzo and looking into your city college for Small Business Courses on any/all subjects (usually free).

Otherwise, ask me specific questions and I or the group might be able to help you.

Cheers!

[SilentPrince]

you can find the sba startup kit to download here..

http://www.sba.gov/starting/indexstartup.html

[Thomas]

Fire capacity and health code capacity for a bar, restaurant, club in Wisconsin is 10 sq ft per useable customer space. Useable customer space is defined by the area customers are allowed to be, not including restrooms. Space occupied by furniture, games or anything else thats not nailed down is entered in the equation. Health code in Wisconsin allows you to set you own capicity not exeeding the fire capacity. The advantage to this is the amount of restroom space needed. Wisconsin health code dictates 1 toilet or water jacket(in each restroom) per 50 occupants. I lowered my occupancy from 255 to 200 in order to save space and cost on bathroom remodeling. Never had a occupancy issue with the local authorities but every case is different.
Thomas

[clubdesign]

to figure occupancy levels for clubs is determined by local codes
a guideline for you to use is take out all the non public space bars, back of the house, etc. For seating areas most towns allow 15 sf per person for dance and stand up the sf is 7 per person.
Most require restrooms for every 50 people and an equal number for male and female. Exiting should be no more than 75 feet from anywhere in the room so plan for it. Occupancy is also related to exitng width and the main exit must accomodate at least half of the occupancy load. If you need more help give Hospitality Design a call at 847 758 9090 or email me

[David]

The best bet is to check with your City Building Code Enforcement Division. They have all of the answers that you seek.