would you buy a Bar in this economy?

[UnderDawg]

we are in the process of THINKING about buying a bar, the banks are shut tight so the current own will carry us for 3 years; bar has been established for 30+ years; current owner has been ther 30 yrs wants to retire, everythingis in tip top shape, just need some input questions ; what should i be asking and looking at other than the normal questions, someone said getting Liq liab ins might be hard??? here's a few questions; if any one wants to answer me direct, budmanoh@aol.com thanks
#1)
we would like to change the name ,would that be a kiss of death or
would change be good.. the crowd is a working class crowd; bike nights are real bikers not yuppies with their custom choppers.
#2)do most owners keep 2 sets of books? or is this a red flag; I have been reading post for weeks on here, but havnt found a check list of what to look for ..do's and don'ts, i have gained lots of info and appreciate it.
#3) what are the %' i should look for, this is a restaurant/bar;
restaurant; bar; payroll; expenses;
the current owner says business is down but there is alot of fat we can trim to make up for their over spending; by this I mean we can do many things in house instead of hiring outside help as they due just because of their ages.. i have a million more question but i'll wait for a response iincase i missed a good post somewhere, thanks

[BadMonkeyBistro]

Hey UnderDawg,

To save from creating a double post, check out my posted comments on this thread and let me know if it helps:

http://www.nightclub-business.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8110

Cheers,
Daniel

[owneroper]

Did you read the "We did it" thread by havensloft? Just to give you some idea

[UnderDawg]

yes I read "we did it" and just about every other thread on here,
I been on here so long reading my wife thinks its a new type of porn site.....
still finding new info everyday,

any good books out there that has help anyone in the buying of a bar?

thanks again

[owneroper]

Why is business down would be the first question, did everybody move out of the area? Your in Ohio, is it the smoking ban? Do you have an area for smokers

Why would you change the crowd? (unless its a bad crowd) and where would you get a new crowd from, why not just "refine" the old crowd.

Can you add something to the name to make it yours instead of completely changing it. 30 years is alot of history to change imo and many will always refer to it as the old name. The Town Tap could be Bob's Town Tap

yes to 2 sets of books but which will you believe. I would believe the irs books as the minimums and use those books along with invoices and educating guessing for the rest.

[Havensloft]

I think you can make money in this ecomony. Everyone likes to go out and forget their troubles for a while. Get out to socialize whatever. I thought it was ging to be bad for me just starting up this past october but it is getting better. Of course, we have a ton colleges around here to help. Good luck in your endeavors.

[UnderDawg]

yeah the smoking ban has caused a drop , but also the economy, our town has lost 2000-3000 jobs in the last 2 years;
the business is holding its own, and even last week when outside temps hit zero the place was packed; its been the same bartenders and decor for 30 yrs;
we want to do a little cosmetic cleaning and up dating , but we say if its not broke , dont fix it, and shoot ourselves in the foot, but we do want to attract, a FOOD crowd during earlier hours and weekends

[Duffman66]

What part of Ohio are you in?

The smoking ban has not affected us that much here.

[UnderDawg]

ne east ohio, columbiana county; smoking ban hurt some; they had just installed 4 new smoke eaters too..
they made a patio area with a small roof for the smokers to brave the elements; But again, more shop closings and more layoffs, numbers have dropped off, but they still
are making money,

[bruce]

How many of my posts you have read, I don't know, but let me give you my thoughts. Laid off people are job hunting, talking, looking for cheap entertainment and they still have to eat. Price is more important to some people than size. Size is more important to some people than price. Do what works for you. Always look for improvement and suttle changes. They hurt less than quick ones. Any small improvement or cleaning that you do will get people to talking and coming around to look. It is also an advertising point "look what we are doing now". Paint is cheap. Hire some of the laid off people to help paint for beer and food. Gives them something to do and you get to know who is a good hand and who isn't without a lot of cash laid out. Have a paint party, spring bbq, Easter egg hunt or party involving as many patrons as possible and don't worry about the economy. What goes around comes around. Children are customers too for a restaurant and parents will buy food for their children and drink a beer when they want to just talk to other adults in the same situation they are in. I have taken my place from a bar doing over half of the business with alcohol to a restaurant doing less than a third of my business with alcohol. January 09 sales were up from January 08 and over
5k up from January 07. For January of 09, alcohol sales were up percentage wise from the previous years. And we are in a recession. BRING IT ON :):)

[UnderDawg]

thanks for the in put bruce;
we submitted our changes on the purchase agreement and all went well; so it looks like a march 1st take over...........
wish me luck ......

[UnderDawg]

well last week the bar owner called and asked, " are you sure you want the bar?" i said yeah!, we have been working on the take over for 3 months now.... SHe said ok then I'll tell the other interested party to F off!, i said cool; then a day later, she calls up and says, "I'm selling to the other people .SORRY" I understood her decision, it was better terms for her, as she was going to carry me for a few years , and the other party has more cash up front.
The kicker now, a week has gone by , they havnt signed anything yet, and the bar manager, asked us if we were still interested becasue it didnt look like thedeal was going to go thru ??? maybe they didnt have the cash like they bragged about??
If it doesnt go thru, should i be eager to jump back in?or should i start a new NEGOTIATION for better terms for ME,....
would like to hear some feed back..
budmanoh@aol.com

[Jallen0]

well last week the bar owner called and asked, " are you sure you want the bar?" i said yeah!, we have been working on the take over for 3 months now.... SHe said ok then I'll tell the other interested party to F off!, i said cool; then a day later, she calls up and says, "I'm selling to the other people .SORRY" I understood her decision, it was better terms for her, as she was going to carry me for a few years , and the other party has more cash up front.
The kicker now, a week has gone by , they havnt signed anything yet, and the bar manager, asked us if we were still interested becasue it didnt look like thedeal was going to go thru ??? maybe they didnt have the cash like they bragged about??
If it doesnt go thru, should i be eager to jump back in?or should i start a new NEGOTIATION for better terms for ME,....
would like to hear some feed back..
budmanoh@aol.com

This is going to be really hard to hear, but do not call the owner back and ask if it is still available. Wait until he calls you and when he does say that you are talking with another person already but would love to hear about all that has changed.

I would prefer to be in the drivers seat rather than head back. And remember, he changed the deal on you at the last minute rather than work with you like he had been for the last several months.

This may be your opportunity to change a part of the deal that you just didn't like.

[Estefon]

Can you share with us what the terms are? 3 years seller-carry-back is all I've read so far. What are the terms?

What terms would you like? What can you offer? What is the seller willing to offer?

I have some extensive knowledge in business acquisition and would be willing to lend a hand. Don't get greedy is my first piece of advice. The ball is in their court.

Steve

[UnderDawg]

Hi, people, WE DIDNT GET the BAR;
but we are working on another deal ,

[UnderDawg]

any one know what the average cost of a 8ft ansul system would cost?

[Havensloft]

[QUOTE=UnderDawg;42125]any one know what the average cost of a 8ft ansul system would cost?[/QUOT

You can find that info online. Jus google ansul system. that should help.

Barbara

[beach1]

Nothing wrong with the economy in Texas. Cigarettes and alcohol are virtually recession proof....

[UnderDawg]

hey people, the bar we missed out on last year at this time is about ready to be repo'd by original owner, , (new current owners have shot them selves in the foot, alienating the regulars , stopping all food sales, firing (2) 20+ year employees, its just nuts, the original owner called and asked if we were interested if she gets it back , we DEClINED
the good willAND REGULAR business has all but been ruined.

So here it is 2010, just signed papers for our new venture, wish us luck!, I'll post a little more as we go through the process again,
and yes I know its not easy, i know the failure rate, i know the economy is tanking, i know the world is going to end DEC 2012, but I say if we dont try it we will always wonder, this way once we start, we will say WHAT WERE WE THINKING

stay tuned!

[owneroper]

good luck with your new adventure

[KeystoneDerby]

Good Luck, even in a bad economy...people drink and eat. Come up with creative ways to gain business and they will stay with you. I ran a pub in a busy area that had little to no day traffic ( mostly business') so we started a 30 min lunch meal for $5.95. It was a quick menu of fresh items, guaranteed in 30 minutes. This was great for the office crowed and we were rewarded when they would come back after work hours. Were we taking a hit on our margin at lunch? maybe..but it paid in dividends at happy hour, and many turned into loyal customers.